Quote from Reuters states the following "China's State Administration for Industry and Commerce (SAIC) on
Thursday ordered local authorities to investigate media reports that
allege skincare products company NU Skin Enterprises Inc distributes
false information and conducts illegal business in China, state news
agency Xinhua said."
This is exactly what China should do with USANA as well. I have for many years been writing about and showing evidence of massive China fraud regarding the recruitment of Chinese Nationals into USANA's Multilevel Marketing structure. This underground operation involves thousands of members which were all signed up in USANA using the same phoney Hong Kong address in order to circumvent the law. The time is now to act and any investigative firm that wants a lending hand, please contact me.
Watchdog: can you please provide a link which clearly shows that 99% of Usana distributors lose money?
ReplyDeletei'm aware of the link to the "Theoretical vs. Actual" page, but even that shows that at least 3-4% of associates make enough to cover the $1,300 per year.
I'm also aware of Fitzpatrick's report, but the 99% figure in that report does not include Usana.
my friend has joined up with this scheme and i'd like to be able to give a defensible number. any help would be appreciated, and I see you saying it very frequently. thanks!
ex-silver director 2009
Deletehey JEFF...
so many ask this same question over and over again in this blog to cover up that 99% truly lose money. What I learned in usana when I was deep in it is that we play mind games and psychology towards possible recruits so that they can't see the negative towards usana. so I will try to explain by usana's comp plan.
Business center one: in order to make 1,000$ you need 10-12k worth of spending power to earn. in order to scam 10-12k worth of $ out of the people, you need to prospect (which takes gas, time supplies, hotel meetings, electricity, a lot of other stuff). so in order for those 10-12k of spending power to be earned again those same amount of people need to sell 100-120k worth of spending power to gain their money back from the products they spent. NOW calculate what they need to SELL to earn to pay for autoship that brings the people earning by less than 10% because as you can see... its obvious 1,000 paycheck equals 10-12K spent... not including shipping!! cost of each product.. YOU don't need a link to understand.. its elementary math... you're question dumbs the people..... my answer just make the compensation plan HONEST. hey Dr. wentz.. since you're an albert Einstein award winner but claim to be like a Saint and a Good person... I know for sure you can see the MATH and its hurting the people... maybe your award didn't include MATH.. just mixing chemicals into a perfect balance soup then coating it with oil to make it shiny.
ex-silver director 2009:
Deleteyou seem to be a bit confused. I am anti-MLM. I believe that 99% lose money, i'm just looking for objective evidence of that fact.
there are resources available that show that 95%+ lose money in Usana. i'm just looking for the link that SHOWS (evidence) that 99% lose money, so that I have some tangible evidence. your hypothetical does not prove this. I asked Usana Watchdog for the link because he refers to the 99% figure frequently. Thanks and best of luck to you.
ex-silver director 2009
Deletethe answer is right in front of you.. the charts.. do the MATH...
your question give the psychological effect that IF 99% failure rate really is true... by asking watchdog you may have changed someone's opinion if they should join or not.. I only answered you that way to make people quit...
I was in usana for 3 years and signed up over 100 people in my downline... the resources online will not convince your friend..... if you want a defensible position... you should challenge the compensation plan.. there's no resources online that covers every situation of the business because usana has a left and right leg... someone could have 20,000 points in one leg and 10 points in the other VS. someone with 250 on the left and 250 on the right and will make more $...
facts online will not convince a brainwashed person.... go join usana and find out..
Compare USANA to how Amway works, the percentage with Amway is well OVER 99%: http://stoptheamwaytoolscam.wordpress.com/what-is-the-basis-for-the-99-level-of-ibos-losing-money/
DeletePlease provide a link to the "Theoretical vs. Actual" link you're referring to.
DeleteTheoretical vs. Actual earnings at Usana:
Deletehttp://www.mlmpyramid.com/Theoretical_versus_Actual.html
I'm still hoping Usana Watchdog can weigh in here. He has used the 99% 10+ times in reference to Usana so i'm assuming there must be conclusive evidence that that's true. Thanks
I think the statement at the bottom of your link takes a lot of wind out of the "theoretical vs. actual" issue. The real question is how much overhead is seen by these distributors, so we can see NET income instead of GROSS income. You can only spend net income, not gross income. Also, how much does the company and/or upper level distributors make from the overhead (training/motivation tools, such as meetings, CDs, books, web sites, voice mail, etc.).
Deleteex-silver director 2009
Deletethis website calculations is not true: if so why is there so many EX-GOLD directors not on auto ship anymore... most of the income is from selling Pro-packs... if you don't sell pro packs then you won't make that income weekly.. how many pro-packs can you sell to your friends until you run out of people you know...
that website says a silver director makes 200 a week... if that were the case why would I not pay autoship for 140$ for a iHealthpak.. sell it on ebay for 80 and keep the 760 profit a month? I quit because of all the heartache I have caused so many families due to broken dreams.. broken lies... I stopped with the lies and my directors in my downline quickly went back to their regular lives (school, jobs, etc)
if this website were true.. why would the 15-20 directors in my downline not be on autoship anymore....if they were making 90$ a week like this website claims? non of the directors under me make this money that this website claims...
93$ a week for a director..... that's about 372$ a month.... who wouldn't want that? I know atleast 30 directors that quit... I know atleast 6 gold directors that quit.. I know atleast 2 ruby directors that quit.. 1 emerald director that quit..
Facts online is not true... like I said before this business is all about how the associates feel..(make them feel negative and they will quit) even if they see the math they won't quit because some top diamond director is brainwashing the life out of their braincells every Saturday training...
if you don't brainwash your downline weekly then commissions will fall apart weekly...
Jeff,
DeleteThe 99% figure is an estimate. It may very well be closer to 99.9%, but since USANA does not publish the actual commissions paid out to each level of associates world wide and does not disclose the number of associates in each level world wide, then there is no way to get "conclusive" evidence since USANA withholds it from public record. However, there have been over 1.6 million USANA associates to date. Less than 0.2% of them were ever considered "full time" sales reps according to USANA. That is USANA's way of defining someone who has reached the ranks of Gold Director and higher.
The individual I know in USANA managed to reach the rank of Achiever. But it cost them over $15,000 in business expenses. Needless to say they are at a loss.
In the past USANA disclosed Distributor average earnings reports for their North American region. From that document it looks as if only 95% of sales reps lost money (still higher than any other industry in the world). However, one needs to understand that the US numbers are skewed higher than any of the other USANA markets because the US associates recruited most all the top associates when the other markets were opening. If USANA disclosed world-wide distributor numbers, it would most likely reveal a loss rate of 99.9%. USANA would never dare disclose worldwide associate numbers like that because it would put them out of business as well as get them shut down by the feds.
If anyone finds themselves in a lawsuit with USANA, simply request the above mentioned information during the discovery phase and USANA will beg to "settle" just like they did with Barry Minkow after his request for discovery. USANA refused to disclosed anything and instead asked the judge to throw out 95% of the court case. Eventually they settled and paid Barry a few hundred thousand dollars to leave them alone.
USANA Watch Dog:
DeleteThank you for replying. I understand that we don't have a definite figure, but I might have some misgivings about repeatedly saying that 99% don't make a profit if we don't know that. The last thing I would want is misrepresentation (however slight compared to Usana's!) on our side of the debate.
Thanks again for your reply and all of your efforts.
Jeff
Jeff,
DeleteI would suggest you demand USANA and/or its sales reps disclose what percentage of distributors do make a profit. They won't give that information, yet it would seem like a crucial piece of information for someone deciding whether to join or not.
Does USANA also have training/motivation tools the upper level USANA folks sell to their downline? Most MLMs are based on Amway, the largest MLM scam on the planet: www.stoptheamwaytoolscam.wordpress.com
ReplyDeleteAlso, what is the estimated percentage of products sold to customers versus distributors?
DeleteUsana Watchdog has stated that based on SEC filings, 90% of products are sold to distributors and 10% are sold to customers who are not distributors.
DeleteCan someone post a link to the 90/10% split?
DeleteUSANA Watch Dog says it here:
Deletehttp://www.sequenceinc.com/fraudfiles/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/USANAPayingToRecruit.pdf
"USANA associates account for 90% of USANA's net sales."
There isn't a reference provided for that sentence though.
USANA Watch Dog: could you be so kind as to provide a link? Thanks.
Nevermind UWD, I found it:
Delete"Notably, sales to Associates account for the majority of our product sales and represented 91% of product sales during 2012."
Usana's 2012 10k SEC Filing.
http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/896264/000104746913002524/a2213469z10-k.htm
I also suggest you contact the people at this site and get USANA added: http://mlmpetition.com/contacts/
ReplyDeleteGuess what day it is people? No its not hump day. Today is the day Usana announced to all their preferred customers that today is usana's annual price increase day. How's that for rewarding their customers that are already over charged for product that hasn't changed for few years. It is more like Swift kick in the gut. This company never has a sale. Their so called 10 percent of product orders on auto shipments is joke too because some how they are allowed to still charge you sales tax amount based on the regular retail price opposed to the 10 percent off price. Wonder where that extra money in sales tax goes. So get ready to pay almost 50 dollars for the essentials, for 28 day supply. Know why it is 28 days and not 30? So they can squeeze 2 extra auto shipments from their preferred customers through out the year. There is nothing special about being preferred except for the fact that we get price hikes etc. Thanks usaba, you can kiss my butt.
ReplyDeleteWhat was the typical price increase? The reason for charging tax on the full retail price is to ensure enough tax is collected. Each distributor can reclaim the difference with their state annually. Let's not make complaints that hold no water, there are plenty of legitimate complaints.
DeleteI feel extremely sorry for most active Usana Associates for fervently believing that they can get rich with their so called Usana business especially those below Gold Director level. Hard as they try with all their resources, the whole business concept is flawed and doomed for failure. Do not take my word for it, do your independent research or keep plodding with the business and only time will tell that failure is inevitable. Better still, interview any honest current or ex-members about their experience and hear their nightmare stories.
ReplyDeleteThis networking or MLM business wrecks relationships and friendships because the active members are so blinded by the business that they only think of recruiting, recruiting, recruiting. A very, very sad truth and the business hurts a lot of people along the way. Be very wary and suspicious of your sponsors motives. Good bye, Usana.
Ex-Usana Associate
Instead of only feeling sorry, why not join the effort to shut down these MLM scams?
DeleteWhy other associates can do it but you couldn't?Why blame the business concept but not yourself?
DeleteJust because one out of 100s to 1,000s "can do it" doesn't mean that the concept is good.
DeleteUsana Watchdog: can you please provide a link which clearly shows that 99% of Usana distributors lose money? I'm curious about this topic. :-)
ReplyDeleteEx-silver director
DeleteHey Juan. To go to convention I assume you have a downline. If you are curious then it only takes a few minutes to go on your downline management system in your account. You will know what each person purchased and their points. All you have to do is write down what each person spent. Count their points (which shows what they can cash out that week) and there's your answer.
You guys are trying to hard to make it sound so bad (oh poor me, I lost out because I couldn't keep up)... please. I've been with USANA for 13yrs and I LOVE IT! If you're so smart than you would know why associates are not worried about auto orders anymore.
ReplyDeleteIn response to "If you're so smart than you would know why associates are not worried about auto orders anymore."
DeletePlease, enlighten us. Why are associates not worried about auto orders (Autoship) anymore?
I lost big amount because of USANA!
ReplyDeleteIncluding my upline! He couldnt pay what he owes to me because as he said he needs to recruit more to cover some of his debts to us(downlines already registered). At first all of us downlines were so eager to sell the products! I almost give up my dream to become a lawyer because he always told me that USANa is the fastest way of getting rich!
But my ultimate goal is only to become a lawyer for free especially to the poor ones! I believe our upline is having a hard time right now coping out his debts to his downline!
Right now me and my husband are planning to sue him...we have to stop his deceitful act and fraud to others!
oooh...you poorthing!!...jejejeje
DeleteMLM is a sales model.
ReplyDeleteThere are sales reps that make it and many can't. Simply sales job isn't the cup of tea for many. Just like in real estate n insurance.
Those who quit real estate and insurance also lose a lot of money due to initial training fees and licence fees.
Usana initial application fee and yearly renewal fee are less than USD50.
The only way the sales rep can lose money is tricked by irresponsible uplines to maintain autoship of ~ USD150 monthly for buying products he or she doesnt truly believe in. Ie the autoship orders are for fulfilling obligations in the hope to achieve commission earning which is reliant on multifactors.
In a worse scenario, incompetent sales rep may also be persuaded by upline to stock up large quantity of products for rank advancement, which the rep doesnt know how to sell off.
MLM systems do open up loop holes for uplines to manipulate on the expense of incompetent downlines.
This phenomenon is all across MLM companies, not specific for USANA.
However, a wise sales rep should only join autoship scheme when he or she agrees with the benefits of the products. The autoship orders if gratefully consumed by the rep should not count as a loss.
If the rep doesnt have confidence selling off bulk products should not buy in bulk despite upline's influence.
So, all in all, if the sales is truthful to his business ie agreeable with the benefits of the products, at the end of 5year period and fail his biz, will lose maximum USD250. This is much less compared to insuance and real estate.
Another ugly scenario is if the sales isn't a sincere sales in the beginning ie not agreeable with products benefits yet want to sell products to people, in the hope of reaping commission, may suffer from a loss of ~USD10000 over a period of 5years, not counting ad hoc bulk purchase he can't sell off.
So, as a fair say, a person should not join MLM if he doesnt believe in the products, it ends up in dishonesty (harming downlines and customers), misconducts, and huge loss (as autoship orders are not consumed voluntarily by himself for his own benefits).
But if a person truly reap benefits from the products, he or she joining MLM maintaining autoship does not cause harm to anybody but will confer benefits from long term consumption of products that truly help the sales. The maximum this sincere sales can lose is less than USD250 over 5years being a memberrship fee to entitle him a chance for passive income. USD250 is justifiable or not, it's up to individuals, but for sure the membership fee is collected legally via signed contract.
My biased experience tells me that 80% sales rep in MLM don't succeed, as sales simply does not suit them. The more tricks they do to sustain a career they are not fitted to, the more loss he attracts. 20% succeeds because they are chiselled for sales and agreeable with products benefits.
Hence it ends up, MLM constantly get complaint, for there are always 80% whose cup of tea is definitely not sales job.
In Central Business Districts, a lot of retails open and close all year round, many also not fitted to do retails. When they fail n lose hundreds of dollars, they have no channel to complain. Hence MLM just happens to be a scape goat for failed business owners to vent their frustrations. Its common place. But there is no need to tarnish the image of MLM companies for the remainder 20% sales rep still need to survive...
MLM is a sales model -- but I see it more as some modified form of customer referral. You refer more customers buying regularly, you get rewards.
DeleteIf you turn this into something similar to USANA:
- You create an account, and for each account, you can only refer up to two customers creating an account for each. One referred customer's account will belong to the right leg and the other, to the left leg.
- Any more accounts created by more customers you refer can be treated as accounts of those referred by the customer you have directly referred. (e.g. Your third friend can belong to the right leg of your referred customer.) Your referred customers can just do the same as you are doing to reap more rewards.
- You cannot get any rewards unless you buy a certain amount worth of products regularly, per account. The same is true for all the referred customers.
- A percentage of accumulated purchases done by all the referrals done in your left or right leg becomes your reward points, whichever goes lower.
- The "deeper" your "legs" branch out, the better -- but your account can only have a maximum amount of rewards. You will have to create another account in which you can have another "pair of legs" to get more referrals, and rewards. In addition, you can place this account in any of your leg to gain more leverage to the rewards system.
This is just the very basics; the real thing goes deeper than this. (Some associates will argue with me for this; they will say "You know absolutely nothing about the binary comp plan." LOL) Nonetheless, if you join an MLM business, you're still no different from a customer, unless you decide to go with a buy-and-sell business using the "required" purchases as your products.
True sales reps are NOT required to buy anything. They just need to sell, and they are not required to buy the rest of the products to reach quota. The training and license feed are just to make one qualified and more 'equipped' to sell.
Waaaaait a minute. I thought MLM reps/associates are treated more as business owners rather than employees? Sales reps are employees too.
Wow - I just sat in a coffee shop in the Midwest to work for a few hours and had to listen to a Usana sales rep make a trainee call for nearly 3 hours. He spoke so loudly I could hear him over the music in my headphones - apparently the person he was talking to was fairly new in the organization. Fortunately he was only smoking an e-cig - wouldn't want to negate all the great benefits of their pills - ha!! Guess Usana is so important he figured the entire coffee shop was his personal office.
ReplyDeleteBy speaking loud so everyone in the coffee shop can hear is part of their marketing strategy. They want to "sound" intelligent and important in hopes that someone listening in the coffee shop might come running to him ready to sign up in his downline. That and these people like to hear themselves talk.
DeletePoor you.
DeleteI specifically enjoy the fact that all comments are monitored and approved to ensure that only the specific image you strive to create on this page is portrayed. Nice.
DeleteYou are kidding me right? I get over 1000 comments a month in my spam box. If I did not "moderate" the comments, this forum would be filled with only spam comments because nobody would bother posting otherwise. If you read the comments I allow on this forum you would know that I allow all comments and all points of views except those that contain fowl language. If something you have written has not shown up, please let me know and I will check the spam box.
DeleteBut why are the products not available in the drugstores if they want to sell their products more?
ReplyDeleteCan anyone answer me?
What did Apple do to sell their products?
What did Coca Cola do to convince people to drink their product?
Why can't Usana use advertisement?
Right, there are advertisements. From people who convince you this is the big thing. Guess what?
My friend's in deep debt just coz of what you people from Usana told him about being "positive".
MLM will still remain MLM no matter what.
Did Bill Gates or Steve Jobs or Mark Zuckerberg did this kind of thing before "getting rich"?
I know suplement is different from all of what these people have invented. But look, they are all "products".
Soooo funny.
Can you never get rich just by working?
Again, funny.
Usana is simple. 20% payout. 50 people weak side is $1000 per month. etc...
ReplyDelete