USANA's latest marketing campaign designed to get USANA products in the eyes of Dr. Mehmet Oz viewers may only benefit the top 1% of USANA associates Gold Directors and above as well as provide means to falsely satisfy associate's 5 customer rule and fool federal regulators.
According to USANA document Trusted Partner and Sponsor of The Dr. Oz Show - Partnership Guidelines
Allocation of Preferred Customers and Sales Volume
Preferred Customers, Sales Volume Points (SVP), and other leads that come in through www.USANAhealth.net - a shopping experience for viewers of The Dr. Oz Show - will be provided to recognition-eligible Gold Directors or above who reside in the United States and Canada.
We will allocate leads to each Associate meeting the above criteria, filtering first by pin level and then by application date. That means we will move down the tree of Associates residing in the United States or Canada, going from the longest tenured Star Diamonds to our new Golds. The process will restart each time every eligible Associate has been allocated a new lead.
This only applies for www.USANAhealth.net. We will follow existing protocol for anything that comes in through www.USANA.com.
So when someone watches the Dr. Oz show that features a USANA product and goes to USANAHealth.net to order the product or become a preferred customer, USANA gives the commission points and preferred customer to a preferential class of USANA distributors who are Gold Directors and above, which represents less than 1% of USANA associates!
This is a very clever trick by USANA that could be used to fool federal regulators such as the FTC by giving the top 1% of associates (who also happen to account for the majority of commissions paid out) customers as a way to automatically satisfy one of the Amway safeguards - USANA's Five Customer Rule, which was designed to protect associates from falling victim to a pyramid scheme. There are not enough preferred customers according to USANA's SEC filings to satisfy the 5 customer rule for most who received a commission check and I believe there are even fewer retail customers. I believe if the FTC were to investigate USANA, USANA would be unable to produce any proof that the majority of commissions paid out were legitimately paid to individuals satisfying the 5 customer rule.
It may also be against the law for USANA to assign customers generated from the Dr. Oz show exclusively to preferential group of distributors as well as paying them commissions for sales those distributors had nothing to do with.
UPDATE - FEBRUARY 11, 2015:
After the 4th quarter earnings statement was released, president Kevin Guest made the following statement regarding the allocation of customers who purchase from the Dr. Oz show after asked about it from a stock analyst during a conference call:
That statement by the USANA president was very misleading when he claimed it was "non-biased". In fact, it couldn't be any more bias. Only Gold Directors and above will benefit, which accounts for less than 1% of USANA's associates.
UPDATE - FEBRUARY 11, 2015:
After the 4th quarter earnings statement was released, president Kevin Guest made the following statement regarding the allocation of customers who purchase from the Dr. Oz show after asked about it from a stock analyst during a conference call:
Reference for this quote can be found on the Seeking Alpha transcript of the conference call.
So we’ve a referral system in place. usana.com has millions of people visit it on a yearly basis. So we do receive referrals that are unsolicited directly from someone. And so we’ve a referral system in place and it's basically the same system that they fall into from a referral system. And it’s computer functioning, it’s non-biased and we distribute those leads just as we would distribute anyone visiting usana.com. - Kevin Guest - President
That statement by the USANA president was very misleading when he claimed it was "non-biased". In fact, it couldn't be any more bias. Only Gold Directors and above will benefit, which accounts for less than 1% of USANA's associates.
This right here clearly explains how ignorant you are. That any new piece of information you manipulate and word your sentences so perfectly that it seems legitmate. The reason that USANA distributes to gold directors and above because those people are clearly active. Why would they distribute to a silver director or below that isn't even in USANA any longer? They empower leaders to become better leaders and if they throw such an incentive like this great!
ReplyDeleteWhat's sad is that you dedicate your entire life to bring down a company that chooses to market its product through people. You bring literally 0 value to the market place.
I admit there are good teams and bad teams people can get involved with and if you get stuck with a bad up line that's your fault for having bad judgement.
Do something productive and write an entire blog about how the school system is a scam or 9/11 is a scam. You're the type of person that this world does not need which are people who LOVE to see others suffer and fail.
This comment probably won't be shown cause of all of my other comments never got posted because you are scared to post this!
Unless your messages were automatically filtered into a spam box which accumulates over 50 spammed postings each day (which does not include your name anywhere in the 3300 sitting in the spam box), or if you include inappropriate 4 letter words (which I just delete the posting then), I post everyone's comments.
DeleteBetween the United States and Canada there are a little over 1000 Gold Directors to Star Diamond Directors. This represents less than 1% of associates in those countries. The products sold by USANA through means of advertising the product on the Dr. Oz Show is a retail sale by USANA, not by any distributor. However, USANA has decided to cherry pick a group of associates (which happens to be the only ones that make a profit anyway because they are at the top of the pyramid scheme) and assign the them the sales points and preferred customers. These associates have nothing whatsoever to do with the sale. The only reason for USANA to do this is to circumvent anti-pyramid scheme laws by automatically giving these associates 5 or more customers which satisfies the 5-customer rule. This rule is in place to protect people from falling victim to a pyramid scheme. USANA is essentially bypassing this rule by providing the customers to these select associates themselves rather than the associate making the sale.
USANA does not market their products through people. They market their products through a pyramid scheme which forces associates to personally purchase product in order to participate in the scam.
You wrote "I admit there are good teams and bad teams people can get involved with and if you get stuck with a bad up line that's your fault for having bad judgement."
99% of associates make no profit... So I guess according to you, 99% of the people in USANA are stuck with a bad upline. The remaining 1% are the upline.
You wrote "Do something productive and write an entire blog about how the school system is a scam or 9/11 is a scam. You're the type of person that this world does not need which are people who LOVE to see others suffer and fail."
It is the exact opposite. I do NOT want to see people suffer and fail, which is why this blog exists. 99% of people who join USANA make no profit. They end up wasting a lot of time and money. There is about an 80% dropout rate for USANA distributors within their first year. By the 5th year, 95% of USANA distributors would have dropped out. Do you tell people that before you attempt to recruit them and try to swindle over $1200 out of them for a Professional Starter Kit?
@Julie - I hope when Usana goes down, you take the time to come back here and apologize to Watchdog after calling up everyone you got into Usana and apologizing to them as well. After that, call up all of the people who turned down your invite to join and tell them they were right and you were wrong.
DeleteIt's going to happen sooner or later. I hope you do what's right even though it'll be super embarrassing.
USANA Watchdog, I hope you are a lawyer. If not, you have absolutely missed your calling. All that energy can be used to solve so many other injustices in the world. Seems like you want to bring down the whole MLM world. Since there are so many on the market and new ones springing up every month, you better get started. It's gonna take a while.
DeleteHowever, USANA has decided to cherry pick a group of associates (which happens to be the only ones that make a profit anyway because they are at the top of the pyramid scheme) and assign the them the sales points and preferred customers.
DeleteI have a problem with that statement.. They are at the top because they got there..not because they are already there or got in early. I personally know 2 who are emerald directors now since joining in 2011 when usana has been there since 1992.
In response to "They are at the top because they got there..not because they are already there or got in early. I personally know 2 who are emerald directors now since joining in 2011 when usana has been there since 1992."
DeleteThey got there by selling a business opportunity. If they relied solely on preferred customers and retailing the product to the general public, then all those that are Gold directors and up would stop making any money and the whole company would either go out of business, or change their business structure by eliminating the whole MLM pyramid scheme. Every single USANA Gold Director and up is where they are because they make selling the business opportunity top priority. They have massive downlines of distributors rather than preferred customers or retail customers. They make almost all their money from the commissions that stem from "required purchases" made by their downline in order to participate in USANA's compensation plan. Almost all of the distributors in their downlines are losing money.
But rather than USANA placing customers that call in because of the Doctor Oz show to distributors in their local area like most logical and fair companies would do, USANA assigns them to a select few Gold Directors and up. They do this with the sole purpose of circumventing the FTC by satisfying the 5 customer rule for those distributors that collect almost all of the commission USANA pays out. Since the FTC is investigating Herbalife and is soon to wrap it up, it will be very likely that MLM companies will have to PROVE that the distributors they are paying the most of the commissions out to actually have 5 or more customers. USANA guarantees this by assigning the customers to the distributors rather than the distributors actually finding the distributors themselves. This completely voids the whole point of the rule in the first place, which is to prevent a pyramid scheme.
Most USANA distributors that are paid a commission do not satisfy the 5 customer rule.
So can you watchdoggies explain why the company is still existing after 20+ plus years. If it was that bad or illegal, it would've been done within 5 years like some internet clicking site which is a scam. OUCH.
ReplyDeleteHerbalife has been around longer than Usana. Just wait until they collapse and you'll have your answer. Actually, if you don't already know then you'll still be confused. To put it simply, it has lasted this long because they've been really good at keeping the FTC off their backs. Over time, the MLM industry as a whole has become too powerful.
DeleteThe only reason Hebalife is starting to collapse is because a hedge fund manager and his team is publicly tearing them down by exposing HOW they're a scam. They've bet tons of money against Herbalife, shorting their stock. Profits will be going to charity by the way. Even with all the proof, lots of people, such as yourself, still can't see why MLMs are scams.
Just wait, once Herbalife collapses, the MLM world will become very interesting.
One comment above asked why USANA has been in operation for more than 20 years, and it should have been shut down if it was illegal. The short answer is the loophole of FTC regulations and USANA just like many other seemingly legit mlm companies out there has been making the best use of human greed and get rich quick psychology. Barry ami low used to dig out the founder of USANA gave up his US citizenship for something.
DeleteJust wait, once Herbalife collapses, the MLM world will become very interesting.
DeleteSo I guess you might have to wait til either you die or they die.. because by the time they do collapse, it might be another 30 years. ..which by then things change..(have been saying this since past 10 years ago). So hope you have better stuff to do with your life than wait 30 years.. heck even another 10 years is a long time!
This is pretty terrible logic. Enron was in operations for over 30 years
DeleteEron collapse because it cook its books, not because they are doing mlm! lmao
DeleteCould you explain how people lose money in Usana or any other mlm for that matter ?
ReplyDeleteThey are required to personally purchase overpriced product that cannot be retailed for any profit margin. They spend a ridiculous amount of money on training material that is useless mumbo-jumbo that isn't ever taught in any business school. There are more associates than there are actual customers due to very little customer demand for the overpriced product and a saturated supply of dreamers who are swindled into a pyramid scheme with the belief they will become rich. Perhaps you are unaware of what an "expense" is. If it is a business requirement to personally purchase product in order to participate in the business opportunity, then that purchase is an expense since it will likely sit in your cabinet for the duration of the year.
DeleteI wonder why you don't react to some people's comments about the product's effectivity but keen on topics of its structure. Just wonderin. I am enjoying reading you blog and people's comments, though.
DeleteI do comment of people's claims about the effectiveness of the product on occasion. My main focus is the company's business model which I believe is a pyramid scheme. Of course every USANA distributor is going to have a story about how the products make them feel better or helped them because they are all trying to convince others to buy it. However, I believe the placebo effect is USANA's top ingredient followed closely by greed.
DeleteHave you try the products? If not, you cannot claim that they do not work. It's like racism who never experience black people before and therefore just think they belong to a certain stereotype.
DeleteI doubt it's a placebo effect. I was a non-believer and refused to take it for 4 months even after my wife nagged me, until I keep having recurrence of gout. After reluntantly talk to a rep who I realize was a nutritionist, I decide to take what she recommended.. I took procosa, proflavnol and biomega intensively for 3 months and never had a recurrence of gout. I did an experiment on myself because I was just like you (well, you see like a hard core extremist who will not listen to any good things about usana other than thinking they are there to make money, which is true, but open up your mind a bit). I kept the same old eating habits.. only thing different was usana intake, and my recurrence gout was gone for a long time. During that time, I still had some doubts, but I slowly took more and I felt better overall not just the gout but awake in general. So I doubt it's a placebo effect because all the time I was taking it, I keep thinking it will come back and thinking I was eating crap vitamin. Yes, I'm stubborn.. in fact most claim it's because I'm an engineer, and most of them are stubborn as I worked with them all the time. But I"m also open minded... it wasn't when a health issue struck, I was open minded to try it. It prevented my gout..and never had once ever again since 4 years ago. After that intensive 3 months, I ease it off slowly and now I'm off of usana product and only take them couple days ... not the everyday intensive regimen they were proposing. This is WITHOUT changing my eating habit mind you. At times when I started to feel tingling sensation around the toe area again, I know it's about to come back, so that is when I start taking procosa again.
Anyways, that's my 2 cents and I doubt you will post this unless you have something to refute against my claim. So it's all selective posting. I might post on another website who will not selective post my comments so that others will know and say this site doesn't allow me to post this. I'm hope I'm wrong about you not posting it here. Now I don't care if you don't believe in the business model or what.. but to ignorantly claim they are placebo effect without really trying it for 3 months intensively is just similar to putting stereotypes into certain races and claim that they are true. I might've hit a nerve here.
I suggest you send your story to news stations and tell them that a preventative treatment by USANA for Gout exists, because as of right now there is no "cure" for it. I can see how taking various vitamins such as Vitamin C, Curcumin, and Glucosamine might reduce inflammation, but what you are suggesting is a product that prevents reoccurring attacks of gout. You wouldn't happen to be a USANA distributor would you?
DeletePlease note that I did said 'preventive' all the time previously. I did NOT say it's a cure and it is not a "cure", mind you. It's like you can PREVENT from having a cold, but there is no cure.
DeleteThere are many products out there that claims to prevent gout..So it's nothing new, UNLESS it's a cure so there is no need to sent to the news station. If there is, it will go to the medical research first before it is publish. Nice try with your sarcasm and attack. I haven't try the other products out there probably because I was like you, thinking they will not work.
I am not a USANA distributor, but my wife is. So from your angle you will think that I'm just as 'guilty'. But mind you, I was a skeptic for about 1 year including the remaining 8 months of just taking it. yes it took 1 full year to finally make me realized I am wrong and willing to admit that I am wrong instead of be so stubborn that even so when 1+1, some people will still say it's not 2. ahhem.
Those vitamins which I mentioned does prevent recurrence of gout..it will NOT cure gout. Will I dare to make a public announcement to claim that as a fact? No Being a person with technical degree, I would like to have real studies done before concluding it officially. But will I dare to make a public announcement that FROM MY own experience and a few others I know, that it stop gout from reoccurring, Yes I would. I already did, esp with all my stubborn friends who happen to have phd in engineering and I did met with a lot of skepticism. But one finally gave it and said it work. Btw, IF it was ONLY me who had gout prevented, I will not even be as daring to say 'from my own experience' because my gout was only at the toe area and not as severe. When my wife knows that it helped my gout she immediately told her coworker whose husband had reccurrence of severe gout every 2 months. Severe as in on the knees and the toes to a point he can't walk nor drive (I can at least drive with pain). I told my wife not to go crazy about it because my case is not as severe as his. But her coworkers wife decide to give it a try and made her husband take Fibergy, hepasil, proflavanol, procosa and biomega).. a few more than what I took. (She made her husband take it because husband are stubborn people..and he is a tech support guy). At first, his gout reoccurred in 1 month and claim that usana is bullcr-p again. But as time went on after the 3 month or so, nothing happened.. He continues to take them and for the entire 10 months for the first time since the gout breakout, he never had a reoccurrence of it as oppose to his usual 2 months. Now I don't know if there are other variabls such as no beer and no meat and only veggies , etc. But her wife said that just quitting the diet alone in the pass didn't help as much as now. Had his gout recurred again.. yes.. after 4 months of not taking them completely. For his case and from my own conclusion and observation, he might have to take it for a long while before easing it off like how I did.
You might again come up with some sh-t that say oh this and that and it's wrong. But what I mentioned are true experience. I don't care about your view on the business model and I don't care about the business model. The fact is the product itself works.. if you are openminded enough to try. Yes, they are expensive but so is douglas labs, which requires a doctor to prescribe or extended life which is also a modified version of mlm hidden behind the business model. Yes I research them too because I wanted to know what the heck is usana's ingredient that my wife is giving to her own mom and her own boss and wonder how good or bad the product is.
Okay, but you wrote "It prevented my gout..and never had once ever again since 4 years ago."
DeleteYour wife is a distributor, which binds you to her business contract with USANA regarding certain claims that can and cannot be made about the products.
According to the FDA: http://www.fda.gov/Food/DietarySupplements/QADietarySupplements/ucm191930.htm#legal_market
QUOTE
Is it legal to market a dietary supplement product as a treatment or cure for a specific disease or condition?
No, a product sold as a dietary supplement and promoted on its label or in labeling* as a treatment, prevention or cure for a specific disease or condition would be considered an unapproved--and thus illegal--drug. To maintain the product's status as a dietary supplement, the label and labeling must be consistent with the provisions in the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act (DSHEA) of 1994.*Labeling refers to the label as well as accompanying material that is used by a manufacturer to promote and market a specific product.
UNQUOTE
Just want you to know you need to be a lot more careful when making claims about USANA's dietary supplements.
That is why I suggested you tell the news stations that some of USANA's products can prevent Gout, because if that can scientifically be proven then it would obviously benefit USANA would it not? I asked if you were a distributor and you claimed you are not, however your wife is which makes you part of the business whether you agree or not. If you were just a customer with no financial ties to the business, then you can make all the health claims you want about USANA.
As I previously stated, some of the ingredients in USANA products have been studied and may reduce "inflammation" of Gout, but there is no known scientifically proven dietary supplement that "prevents" reoccurring gout attacks. Perhaps you have found the solution however.
Yes I wrote that and never did had another occurrence since 4 years ago. But I never say it was a cure. You were assuming that I said it was a cure (perhaps due to extreme bias against usana and their members).
DeleteWhat I said is no different then other people telling others "Exercising and running prevented me from getting a cold, I have never had a cold in the past 5 years". This is not the same as saying "Exercising and running is the cure for cold".
The same goes for the phrase "An apple a day keeps the doctor away".
People can say "Eating apple keeps me healthy and prevents me from getting sick. I haven't gotten sick for the past 5 years". It does not say "eating apple is a cure to stay healthy." BIG DIFFERENCE in that choice of word - prevent and cure.
Yes, my wife is a distributor and you can say all you want and I know it's a conflict of interest so you are thinking distributor are out there to make money (if that is the case, wine distributors are also out there to get your money..so is everything else because everything is money). But mind you, I can say no I'm not a distributor and that should make my case even stronger because that will consider unbias. But I did not do that did I? No, because all the things I spoke previously are the truth. Why would I lie about it. What do I win if I win this argument? I'm just losing time right now posting because you are trying to attack me and calling me a liar for saying their product works when in fact they do work. That I'm annoy about especially if you never tried them. If anyone defend usana somehow, you will somehow think of a way to assume that they have some financial interest for promoting usana even if it is untrue. So I'm not going to argue with someone who is stubborn because of their pure hate and bias.
That link you provide to get your point across is just going to the extreme. If everyone was like you, webmd.com will go down the drain. http://www.webmd.com/arthritis/news/20090309/vitamin-c-may-help-prevent-gout
Note that it says "VITAMIN-C FROM food OR SUPPLEMENTS may *PREVENT*.." (magical word for you, don't assume). So how are people going to get vitamin C from supplements? You buy supplements.. OR EAT TONS OF ORANGES which many people cannot do. The SUPPLEMENTS themselves CANNOT be promotes as a treatment nor a cure as it said on that fda site, BUT NOT THE VITAMINS THEMSELVES. The reason why fda doesn't allow supplements to be promoted is because no one knows what the heck is in those supplements because they don't show them in technical detail form. But vitamins are necessary for the body because you get them from food or you can get them from a supplement that you trust.
Now, note that the supplement company themselves cannot promote it. But it does not mean people in general cannot say "hey, this GNC vitamin brand is good..it stops me from getting cold and good for your heart". It happens all the time.
In fact, I'm pretty sure if USANA was not MLM and just on the shelf and people say USANA is good, you will not be here having this discussion because your hate is on the mlm business model. Please keep in mind.. business model and product are 2 separate things.
1) I never claimed you wrote cure. I wrote the following
DeleteQUOTE
I suggest you send your story to news stations and tell them that a preventative treatment by USANA for Gout exists, because as of right now there is no "cure" for it
UNQUOTE
What I did say is for you to go and tell the news stations that a "preventative treatment" exists. Why? Because you claimed "IT prevented my gout."
which brings up point 2) You specifically claimed the USANA products "prevented" your gout. That is an illegal statement (by violating FDA rules) to make because:
Point 3) You are a USANA distributor by default of your wife being a distributor. You seemed fully aware of the fact USANA can't make the statement when you wrote "Now, note that the supplement company themselves cannot promote it." Yet, you pretty much are part of the company.
I was not attacking at all. I am simply giving some friendly advice about being careful what you say or write because of your relationship with USANA. The FDA wouldn't excuse you just because you yourself is not the distributor even though your wife is.
Also, I never called you a liar or suggest it didn't prevent your gout. In fact, I encouraged you to tell the news stations about it because there is no dietary supplement that has scientifically been proven to PREVENT gout.
Ok, that's fair. I thought you were calling me a liar because for everything I said you sort of object and try to refute it.
DeleteAs for your number 2 argument, I dare you to arrest me if I said because it is not illegal. It's no different that someone saying hey this one-a-day vitamin help prevent me from getting a cold/gout/etc. So are you going to arrest the guy? That is ludicrous. What the people are doing are just sharing their experience that the vitamins in this supplement are helping them.
They can go through the whole shebang about vitamin B12, C, D or etc are helpful and prevent me from getting a cold and then the other one will ask so how do I know what to eat...and you point to the any vitamins you choose and they will ask which one and you will recommend 'well, I use this vitamin brand and it help'..and then other one will just buy it. So let me ask you... I dare you to go call the cops and arrest that guy who recommended that vitamin brand to the other guy because he said it prevented his him from getting cold/gout. smh.
Or I can just switch it around and say the vitamin maintain healthiness which INDIRECTLY means preventive treatments.
As for you number 3 argument, you are making another assumption there just because I said "Now, note that the supplement company themselves cannot promote it". That itself does not prove that I'm part of the company because I know this way before I know usana because my sister works for Merck writing documents to persuade drug companies to try the new drug and something relating to clinical research, and my mom is into supplement pills even before usana come into discussion. So my sister already told my mom that and therefore I already know the reason why supplement company are not fda approved and therefore they don't there to promote it because it can lead to lawsuits because they didn't try it out of people clinically.
In fact, I used this statement against the rep when she was introducing it to my wife and my mom specifically when she said something about FDA approved. I later on press on the issue and she clarified it by saying no supplement in this world are FDA approved..but the raw material that the pill are made of are approved.. that's all I know.
Finally, it doesn't matter how many times anyone post something good or bad about the product here. I do not think you can drag down this usana company. I can bet you 1 million dollars that you cannot drag down this company within 5 years, UNLESS some big bad thing happend such as someone got so sick or end up dead. In fact, it might be around for another 15 years and no cigar. It's good that you are doing these research that bystanders can see and decide if it is for them, but for people who experience it, might be a different story.
Let me make this clear. I am referring to those who are marketing a product and being compensated for it. I believe you are by default a marketer of USANA because your spouse is a sales representative for the company.
DeleteYou wrote "It's no different that someone saying hey this one-a-day vitamin help prevent me from getting a cold/gout/etc. So are you going to arrest the guy? That is ludicrous."
A sales representative from USANA cannot make such a claim.
http://www.berkeleywellness.com/supplements/other-supplements/article/supplement-claims-whats-allowed
QUOTE
It can say “supports the immune system” but not “helps prevent colds and flu.”
UNQUOTE
I'll tell you what, I'll let USANA themselves back up everything I have been telling you... The following is straight from USANA's Policies & Procedures.
QUOTE
3.4.1 product claims
USANA Associates may not make claims that USANA products have therapeutic or curative properties except those contained in official USANA literature. In particular, no Associates may make any claim that USANA products are useful in the cure, treatment, diagnosis, mitigation, or prevention of any diseases. Such statements can be perceived as medical or drug claims. Not only are such claims in violation of the Associate Agreement, they also violate the laws and regulations of the United States, Canada, and other jurisdictions.
3.1 ACTIONS OF HOUSEHOLD MEMBERS OF AFFILIATED INDIVIDUALS
If any member of an Associate’s immediate household (an Associate’s spouse or dependents) engages in any activity, which, if performed by the Associate, would violate any provision of the Associate Agreement, such activity will be deemed a violation by the Associate.
UNQUOTE
For the fourth time now - just be careful about the claims you are making. I don't know why so many USANA associates get defensive when I'm actually trying to help them.
Perhaps they get so defensive because this site is an attack on their product that they are selling and one negative review can equal to 5 good reviews. But in my case if all the reviews are all 100% (5/5) good (not even 90% or 80% (4/5) which are still good), I will be looking into the product to see its flaws instead of a neutral mind because no way can a product satisfies everyone 100% (5/5) with a rather big sample (say 50 samples) The opposite is true.. if the reviews is 0/5- all of them.. this means a product fails miserably, I will look at what caused it as it might be human bias. Yes, I'm a devil advocate by nature..and that is also why I tend to pull to the other end on this site as it's attacking a product especially when it's a product I had experience using. (If this was a site where usana was praise constantly and where it constantly say you have to eat it with a certain dosage, I will end up saying it's not 100% necessary to eat it twice per day as reps or the box claims because too much of something is never good and I will also be attack by the moderator who created that site..or comment won't even appear)
DeleteI kept challenging you because I was annoyed since I was assuming you were calling me a liar when I know from my own experience the product works or 'supports my bones so they remain healthy and very less likely to get deterioated or disease or my in case it seems to ease off my gout til it doesn't hurt anymore'.(there is that better to your satisfication). But if I never tried it nor had any connection with usana, will I still post things here that seemingly go against mlm watchdog.. Yes, because as I said - devil advocates is my nature because I tend to like to open up different possible POVs because most people who are completely bias to one side are blind to the other side unknowingly. So What will I say If I never have any connection with usana and I saw that this site is anti-usana? I will just ask a simple questions - have you tried the product and why are you going full fledge against something, etc. and maybe people say the product is expensive but I can say how expensive something is, just like love, is at the eyes of the beholder, etc.
Well, I see you don't care much about the fact you are not allowed to make medical/drug claims about USANA products preventing your gout. It's not my fault the rule exists. I'm just pointing it out. Do you know why it exists? It's there so snake oil salesmen cannot make unsubstantiated claims about a dietary supplement. Perhaps if medical research and enough studies are done that can statistically prove that a formula of dietary supplements has a given benefit, then the claims can be made by the sales people promoting it.
DeleteIf you came on here and made the claim like you did but made no mention of being related to a USANA distributor such as your spouse, then I wouldn't have carried the conversation on any further. It is not my place to tell you that your belief that USANA products have prevented your gout is false? It's not my place. I will make general statements that the most effective ingredient that USANA uses is the placebo effect as a sarcastic way to say the effects most people have from vitamin supplements is not actually attributed to the product. Do you doubt the power of the placebo?
Since you bring up devils advocates, you'd be surprised at how good I can do playing both sides of the argument. I've been at this since 2006 and have heard it all. Should I make a pro-USANA blog on the side and argue with myself? That would be entertaining, for me at least...
If you came on here and made the claim like you did but made no mention of being related to a USANA distributor such as your spouse, then I wouldn't have carried the conversation on any further.
DeleteSee that's the thing, IF I'm here to purposely make strong claim about USANA and to battle the negativity reviews of this site because it can affect any reps businesses, I will not say that my wife is a USANA distributor and say instead that I am not a distributor at all nor anyone that I know.. nor will I say ..hey my wife is one when you asked. Why? It is call a conflict of interest because in any argument if there is no indirect link or link at all, it's more plausible. So to that effect, I will purposely say, no I am not a distributor, blah, to make is sound plausible.
But again, like I said, I didn't do that, did I... because what I said previously are all true based on my experience. I do not distort the truth. If I took the product and it s-ucks, I will say that REGARDLESS if my wife is a distributor. In fact, don't you think I would've stopped her by now.. she is giving it to her mom and my mom..and in fact, I was the opposing force in the family because she doesn't know the vitamins well enough to just randomly let people to try. I end up doing more research than she does but still took me 1 full year to finally say it's not bad. Now, you might be thinking, it might be 1 full year of brainwashing or whatever (yes, since you say you are devils advocate, this is what you might be thinking too). But first. a distributor doesn't mean she is to make sales.. she can just be a consumer like what they called preferred customers. Second, I'm well aware of the placebo effect and because of that, as I said previously, I was the one who constantly thinks it will not work EVEN as I'm taking them. Placebo effect is thinking that the pill which was taken, which has no effect in reality, does have an effect on the body. I know that so I thought of the opposite all the time. But after taking it for a while, as cliche as it sounds, I felt better then before.
Can a sugar pill do that to you? I doubt it.. maybe temporary, but for long term..and it's been 3 years total that I first tried it. There was also no other variables because I wanted to experiment it on myself.. I kept everything the same.. which also meant no exercise for over 1 year and still don't exercise.
Since you bring up devils advocates, you'd be surprised at how good I can do playing both sides of the argument. I've been at this since 2006 and have heard it all. Should I make a pro-USANA blog on the side and argue with myself? That would be entertaining, for me at least...
Maybe you should.. to bring out all the points to argue back and forth. It will be interesting to see what opposing points that you can come up with. So for every negative stuff ever mentioned about usana, you defend it. how's that. I do that for certain things to come to a final conclusion. I am not surprised that you will be a good devils advocate because I read a few of the posts that for every pro-usana argument, you were about to dig details and able to see the other side (in fact most people who has some sort of technical degree, like a few of my friends who had comp sci, science or engineering degrees, are trained to think that way. So I'm assuming you might have technical degree).Nothing is wrong with defending usana or going against it.. ..but if that is the case, you will need a ying and a yang to be fair.
why usana dont allowed its members to advertise their products in the facebook and other social networks?
ReplyDeleteApproached-by-distributor
ReplyDelete@USANAWatchdog I hope you can answer my questions. I found out about Usana a few days ago when approached by a friend/ddistributor and wanted to do some research before purchasing anything. I couldn't find any nnon-usana related websites backing their claims. Which is why I'm glad I found you.
1. About you.
You seem to understand alot about how these systems work. Are you a business major? Or perhaps a health Science major(Since usana is a vitamin company)?
2. Regarding Dr. Myron Wentz
His wikipedia page has so little information it's suspicious. Who is he? Is his phd even legit? I could not find any of his academic research papers.
2. Albert Einstein award??!!
Are they teaching their distributors to say that? Its a physics award. When doing research I found out the award is actually Albert Einstein Award for Outstanding Achievement in the Life Sciences. Is this even a legit award? I've never heard of it, and there's no wikipedia page!
3. Regarding Dave Wentz (CEO)
No wikipedia page??!! Who is he?
4. Regarding Lyle Macwilliam
My friend said comparative guide is a third party book so its trustworthy. But, lyle macwilliam has no wiki page??!! Even the book does not. Who is lyle? Is hos work trustworthy?
5. Regarding MIMS
Another proof of usana being good is that their products appear in the mims, which is some monthy medical index (i cant remember). I dont really know what this is. Can you explain? I only found some of your posts about the physician's desk reference. Are they the same thing? If it's such a dodgy product how did they manage to get into the mims?
I hope you can answer my questions to clear some things up, (and to save the world from usana).
thanks in advanced. :)
1. About you.
DeleteYou seem to understand alot about how these systems work. Are you a business major? Or perhaps a health Science major(Since usana is a vitamin company)?
I am not a business major nor do I have a degree in any health sciences. However, I do have an engineering degree. I was approached about USANA 9 years ago by a family member. I did my homework and believe much of what USANA does and says are half truths and stretched truths. I beleive the business model for associates is a product-based pyramid scheme where participants are forced to personally purchase product to participate. These forced purchases pay commissions to upline associates who got in earlier and is the primary source of the funds used to pay commissions (rather than from customer purchases outside the business opportunity).
2. Regarding Dr. Myron Wentz
His wikipedia page has so little information it's suspicious. Who is he? Is his phd even legit? I could not find any of his academic research papers.
He does not have "celebrity" status and therefore has less written about him on wikipedia. His credentials are sound and the research he did before USANA is good. When he formed USANA he chose a business model that forces the product into the hands of the distributors by primarily marketing the "business opportunity" to become rich rather than market the product for the general public (if he had, the price of the product wouldn't be jacked up so high just to fund the commissions that less than 1% of distributors make a profit from).
2. Albert Einstein award??!!
Are they teaching their distributors to say that? Its a physics award. When doing research I found out the award is actually Albert Einstein Award for Outstanding Achievement in the Life Sciences. Is this even a legit award? I've never heard of it, and there's no wikipedia page!
Myron Wentz's Albert Einstein Award is a fraud. It was a made up award given out by Global Capital Associates, an investment firm which no longer exists. USANA associates should be embarrassed to even mention this award because it didn't even come from the science community.
3. Regarding Dave Wentz (CEO)
No wikipedia page??!! Who is he?
https://www.usana.com/dotCom/about/management/dwentz.jsp
He is the son of Myron Wentz.
4. Regarding Lyle Macwilliam
My friend said comparative guide is a third party book so its trustworthy. But, lyle macwilliam has no wiki page??!! Even the book does not. Who is lyle? Is hos work trustworthy?
The book is not third party. USANA Distributor Gregg Gies joined Lyle Macwilliam in creating the Comparative Guide to Nutritional Supplements in the late 90s. His responsibilities were "Research, Layout, and Editing" of all editions of the books. He also co-founded Nutrisearch. The biasness doesn't end there. I have written much about this on this blog at: http://usanawatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/12/usana-and-comparative-guide-to.html
5. Regarding MIMS
Another proof of usana being good is that their products appear in the mims, which is some monthy medical index (i cant remember). I dont really know what this is. Can you explain? I only found some of your posts about the physician's desk reference. Are they the same thing? If it's such a dodgy product how did they manage to get into the mims?
As with the Physician's Desk Reference, it is simply a paid advertisement. The reason USANA stands out more in those books is because they paid to advertise their products in books meant as a reference for "drugs", not "dietary supplements". There are other books for that.
I hope you can answer my questions to clear some things up, (and to save the world from usana).
thanks in advanced. :)
Good Luck!
Approached-by-distributor
Delete@USANAWatchdog
Thank you so much for the information. It really helped. Guess I'll just stick to pharmaton. :)
@Watchdog: I totally agree with you.
ReplyDeleteThe amount of binary / pyramiding companies are TOO DAMM HIGH! USANA IS A SCAM FOR SCUMBAGS
ReplyDeleteI heard that you have to pay certain amount every month to use Usana's website.
ReplyDeleteWhat can u say on that?
That is correct: USANA Associate Price List See Item #824 on the last page.
DeleteThe Income Maximizer 4-week subscriptions - Includes: Downline Management / Webhosting / Tax Advantage / eCards / WebMail: $19.95
That's a 4 week subscription so the yearly price is $259.35
Thank you USANA Watch Dog for a very informative blog.
ReplyDeleteI'm not an associate nor distributor but a satisfied USANA Essentials user.
$47.45 for a 224 tablets seems reasonable. keep healthy and happy! God Bless to All...
Another perspective is this:
DeleteTablets Per Box: 224
USANA Essentials (Associate & Preferred Customer Price): $44
Shipping: $10
Empty Box: 28 days
Computing.....
Tablets per year: 2912
Cost of Essentials per year: $570
Shipping: $130
You think $700 and 2912 tablets later is reasonable? I think you are paying too much. About $260 of the money you paid for the essentials for the year goes to enrich associates at the top of a pyramid scheme. If USANA didn't run a pyramid scheme, the Essentials would only cost you $24 per box.
Can you honestly tell me you would rather pay $44 for a 28 day supply of USANA Essentials rather than just $24?
Who cares. If they think it's worth it, it's worth it and reasonable. Over price, not over price.. with relative to high quality are all everyone's subjective opinion and to you, high quality is all over price. You are willing to take low water pills as vitamin if they cost 1 dime a box.
DeleteLook at the real estate market in bay area. Is it over price? Some people think it is and most do. But is it worth it. I think it might be because ppl there still buy it as they think that area is 'high quality' and therefore willing to pay for it. So based on your logical argument that you are using, no one should buy houses in the bay area and likewise, no one should buy apts in manhattan.
Look at crappy LA area, certain slum area are so low but no one buys them. Why don't you go buy them.
People are buying the real estate because there is a demand for it even at the price it is selling for. On the other hand, USANA distributors cannot resell the product for a higher price than they pay because preferred customers get the product at the same price! Therefore, there is zero profit margin in retailing USANA products. Supply of USANA distributors and the vitamins is extremely high, but the demand is extremely low. That is why 99% of USANA distirbutors make no profit. That why there are almost 4 distributors for every 1 preferred customer.
DeleteThe only reason USANA makes money is because the distributors are forced to purchase over $120 worth of product 13 times a year in order to maintain any of their group volume points, be commission eligible, and be eligible for participation in USANA's many contests and other little schemes to pressure its distributors to continually buy over priced product they cannot resell.
If USANA no longer required its distributors to purchase the product to participate in the compensation plan, then most distributors would stop purchasing the product, the Gold Directors and up would no longer make any commission and quit, and USANA's pyramid scheme would collapse and USANA would go out of business.
So, why don't you think USANA distributors should be able to get the product at a much lower price as I described in my previous posting? You don't think distributors should be able to retail the product and make money???
People are buying the real estate because there is a demand for it even at the price it is selling for. On the other hand, USANA distributors cannot resell the product for a higher price than they pay because preferred customers get the product at the same price!
DeleteAh, that's where you are wrongodongo my friend. There is a DEMAND for the product. How else did the company stay afloat for 30 years. Scam will kill it. Your sample of the number of demand is small. You said they are force, it ain't force. If they are forced to buy, they will stop buying in like 3 months, or some even cancel right away. They tried the product and they like the product so that is why some prefer to continue on for months..cancel and buy again like other products. Some out right cancel without trying thinking it's expensive and pointless also like other products. That's fine. Also retail is for people who are NOT preferred clients, they are the ones who buys on usana's website so they pay the retail price which is higher. BUT as with all import/export biz and other retailer selling on line, there are always ways to make money without using the standard brainless retail selling for higher price method. And no, they don't even need to recruit. There are websites who are selling lower than usana's website prices, but at the prefer customers price without being prefer customers. Prefer customer is just like other customers where they get discount.. it's no different than proactiv or other beauty and skin care products where they will continue to charge you per month until you cancel. Those are not mlm.
Again You are thinking 1 dimensionally where buy low and sell high. The business model can have various ways to make money like other stores..not just the 1 dimensional buy low and sell high. You pay 100 bucks and sell it for 100 bucks which is zero dollar profit.. which you say you can't make money. That is false. Like I say you do not understand business nor the way business model works. Someone can buy it for 100 bucks and resell it for 90 bucks and still make commission. So people who buys for 100 and sell for 100, makes even more. You will know how if you REALLY understand the business model. Heck, I hear someone can sell it for 30% discount and still make money and I ain't pulling chains here.
I suggest you really think how the method works before embarrassing yourself with all these pointless technical data nonsense, because you are just an outsider right now blahing on cr-p when the insider knows how it works and how distributors able to make money without recruiting (like other mlms like marketamerica) and just selling the products.
You write "You pay 100 bucks and sell it for 100 bucks which is zero dollar profit.. which you say you can't make money. That is false. ... I suggest you really think how the method works before embarrassing yourself with all these pointless technical data nonsense..."
DeleteUSANA distributors who "resell" or "retail" the product make no commission. Perhaps you are the one who needs to understand how USANA's compensation plan works. USANA distributor cannot purchase the product for $100, resell it for $100, and expect to collect a single penny in commission. You are being deceptive and misleading which is the root of the problem with USANA and distributors like yourself.
Ahh.. I'm an insider so I know how it works. You are an outsider pretending you know when you don't. Again you really don't know cr-p but assuming you do. I know people how have been doing it and they are the top distributors. You have been thinking too small. There is more than 1 way to skin a cat. If you are that smart you should be able to figure it out...but requires connections. Just a plain new distributor doing it will not work. It's until after some hard work and connections then you will know how. Again, you and many others never reached that stage.
DeleteYou failed to address my point that distributors who resell the product make no commission. Another MLM company, Vemma, was recently shut down by the FTC for operating a pyramid scheme. Their main point was that product was not being retailed to the general public, but primarily only sold to distributors.
DeleteNow if you want to violate USANA's policies and purchase additional downlines just so you can recollect on commissions and rise up in leadership rankings, be my guess. I know several ways for distributors to make money, but they all rely on bogus downlines and none on actually selling product.
You failed to address my point that distributors who resell the product make no commission
DeleteYou failed to understand how the usana system works LEGALLY. You buy low and sell high when there is a demand. How hard is it to understand 7th grade economics. That is money right there on profit margin and commission. Again, if you can't understand this, you have no right to post whatever you are posting here because it shows you do not understand.
Yeah Vemma...and herballife can be next.
http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2015/09/10/the-ftc-shut-down-vemma-for-being-a-pyramid-scheme.aspx
So what about usana. It never said usana will be next. Because something or someone prompt them to investigate.
I know several ways for distributors to make money, but they all rely on bogus downlines and none on actually selling product.
Bull. you don't know several ways. Your several ways is just touch the surface. You got all the ideas here from others telling you inside stuff like someone posting about it. So, let's see you explain the details in another blog post..there that's an idea for you..if you really know. Also, you are dead wrong on 'none actually selling product'. There are a group of people who rise to ranks just by selling to prefer customers and to other people. ONLY SELLING, no recruiting. Right there already made your argument weak and uncredible.
@Usanawatchdog, I would like to express my gratitude to your dedication on the research of the Usana MLM scam. I personally found reading your posts and comments quite helpful and convincing and I like the way you structured your answers to be objective and evidence based. I have a female friend who has been brain washed my the Usana MLM scam and she just totally 'betrayed' her medical and science training and blindly to believe the biased research and claims done by Usana. She is using her health related background to persuade innocent people to believe the Usana product is the ultimate cure for diseases, which is misleading and irresponsible. She has never practiced in the field she graduated but made use of the degree as a cover to support her claims---she is not even major in dietary study at all! I am so disappointing at her choice although I respect her choice as an adult. Hope your blog will continue save other people from falling into the trap. P.S. I really hope these MLM business will eventually collapse one day.
ReplyDeleteI dont believe the products are bad. Over priced? Absolutely. Better than your One A Day or Centrum? Absolutely. Magic pill to cure all diseases? No way. I take them, and feel better when I am on them. I workout a lot and the procosa and fish oil really help keep my joints with recovery. I am not a distributor so not making any claims here. The worst thing about Usana is the way they brain wash their distributors, tricking them they can get rich, while making them pay at least $100 each month to remaim eligible for commissions. The business models is a masked scheme that only pays a few at the expense of thousands who never make a dime. Give your friend a smack upside the head and tell her to get back into her field. She will only lose money in Usana and some friendships as well. Hope this helps.
DeleteP.S. I really hope these MLM business will eventually collapse one day.
DeleteDream on.. they have been saying the same thing for the last 30 years.
And if it does collapse or be illegal, there are always chinese people in China to buy them at hefty price (supply and demand and illegals tends to jack up prices) and thus benefits the distributors who actually does sell to China. Chinese people in China are very into health and there are many vitamins out there, but they end up choosing USANA.. why? I don't know.. maybe because it works and to them money is not a problem.
No serious money is not a problem. What is expensive to people living in the USA is nothing for them. USA iphone sells for 600 to 800 dollars.. You buy it for 800 bucks you can double your profit (1500-1600 US dollars)if you sell it in the black market in china...but they are picky.. must be gold color. Thus many middlemen makes money by taking chunk. They can buy houses that cost 1 million dollar US in CASH in Cali and NY...and this is a teacher. So you are just doing those distributors who has chinese connection to sell to a favor and make their USANA business gain profit...and the company gain more profit. Yes, it's illegal to sell to china..but who the heck are you or anyone going to find out and what prove do you have. None. So good luck with your dream.
In response to "And if it does collapse or be illegal, there are always chinese people in China to buy them at hefty price (supply and demand and illegals tends to jack up prices) and thus benefits the distributors who actually does sell to China."
DeleteNevermind the fact that China has banned MultiLevel Marketing companies to conduct business within their country because they agree that MLMs are pyramid schemes........ Do you know what the Chinese Government does to people who break their laws?
And do you know why Chinese government banned MLM? It's because Chinese people are into whatever fr-king which way to making money. They use their brain power mostly to think how to make money and save money. The power of MLM business schemes or whatever you want to call it is so good and strong that whenever you have something that strong and powerful, people will abuse the power. Chinese are known to abuse the power of anything. So if they never ban MLM, you will have EVERY merchandise and clothings out there using some sort of MLM. So the government have to stop it at one level of network marketing. Plus the Chinese market has the MOST vitamin and herbal supplements out there. All of these will end up being MLM because it's that powerful. Why do you think most MLM are comprise of asians anywhere outside of china... because it's that powerful. A powerful business model that has no limitations will make the government scare and that is why Chinese govt put a stop to it. You should know how Chinese government or any government is scare of something powerful because it's unknown and can take over the government somehow.
DeleteIt's the same with franchises in the past where when it got too big in the USA, the government stepped in to enforce rules. MLM got too big in China and thus, the government place laws for it. That doesn't mean it's really illegal...it's still simply call network marketing with just one level as oppose to multiple.
Hi,
ReplyDeleteit would be helpful, if you could share with me your reviews of the effectiveness of usana products? do you have also a review on xtend life company and its effectiveness of products?
thanks,
ex-silver director 2009
Deletethe cost to review vitamins is not worth it.... Lets just say if USANA was so great then athletes will be taking them often enough like athletes use ice to help with their sore knees... the positive usana vitamins give isn't enough performance or health effectiveness to be mentioned.. just like Tylenol helps with peoples headache, it has worked often enough to claim..... what usana claims their vitamins to do has not be recognized often enough to be true...
dude, Tylenol also has side effects. all vitamins' 'side effects' is excretion of supposedly toxicity. No wonder what you are a silver director and only got to that level.. you don't know enough. Do some research and stop making false claims because some atheletes do take them. Ice can help with anything temporary. You will get sore knees with enough exercise because of muscle as that is the nature human body. What you are implying is usana is a cure all, which is not. If that is what you are implying, then again I reiterate, no wonder why you failed usana and can never get above silver director because of that ignorance. How do you know they also don't take vitamins in addition to using ice?!
DeleteAlso checkout https://www.multivitaminguide.org/#comparison-table
Here is the review of all vitamins.
DeleteNotices that MLM vitamins are ALL better than centrum or all other vitamins selling via NON-mlm. So vitamins itself AND the distribution method are not 100% related. bad vitmains can have good distribution method and good vitamins can have bad distribution method- method where everyone thinks it's a scam.
Product != business model.
https://www.multivitaminguide.org/#comparison-table
And this is a non profit org too. Usana is number 4 out of over 100.
btw, Extendlife is NUMBER 1.. AND it is also an MLM underdisguise. I don't see any watchdog say anything about extendlife which is recent. It tricked them. USana must have hit one of their nerves.
If I use that ex-silver director 2009's logic where tylenol worked often enough to claim, I can say the same that usana is better than extend life because it's been longer for over 20 years so more people experience it and claim that it works then that extend life where it's much less years of existence..and build by business people who hired scientist instead of the scientist themselve building it up.
Watchdog, what's your email. I have some data for you to crunch.
ReplyDeleteOn the right side of the blog is a contact email. Here it is anyway: usanawatchdog@gmail.com
Delete@Watchdog what happened to the friend / distributor that approach you 9 years ago?
ReplyDeleteThey eventually stopped purchasing anymore product. They were suckered in big. They were even convinced to purchase two distributorships (both spouses) once USANA allowed that to happen. USANA pushed the idea that two distributorships was a way to maximize your potential profits. So with two distributorships both with the 3-business center plan, they were out over $10K. There was USANA business material all over their house. They reached out to everyone they knew and more. Very few joined. They went to all the meetings as well as annual conventions. They were convinced they would make millions and were convinced the products were superior to any competitors. Why? Because USANA upline leaders told them so. And because thoes leaders were rich, they believed them...
DeleteBasically, you're saying that they lost money? How about title advancement or anything USANA related to brag about?
DeleteThey lost over $10K... They managed to reach the rank of "Builder" (on one distributorship) and "Believer" on the other. They both started at Believer. I know the original distributorship had purchased the $1200 Professional Pack to begin with. Not sure about the second distributorship.
DeleteWhat most distributors neglect to admit is that there are a lot of expenses besides the mandatory product purchases.
How long did they keep themselves in the game for.
DeleteAbout 6 or 7 years
Delete6 or 7 years.. and lost about $10,000 total for 2 people. For a business, that is not bad of a lost at all.
DeleteThere are others who lost hundred of thousand of businesses...and yet they lost only over 10k..even 15k lost is nothing for a business over 7 years. In fact, most businesses lost even more. and they have to close doewn in 1 or 2 years.
So kudos to them for keeping it that long with the business. That also means that they did make money during that span. Maybe they were making profit and then they end up losing some near the end of the 6 years span it as downlines dropped out while they themselve stop doing the business.
Also I know some people who only takes the vitamin and doesn't do anything because they have no intention of doing business and spent total of about $9000 to $10000 over the span of 7 years..which is basically mostly autoshipments and addition products she bought...and that is for 1 person. (100x12x7 is $8400..so I believe her when she said she spent that much over 7 years). That is equal to some people auto insurance.
So for them to lose a total of 10 k for 2 people total..which is aboutr 5kto 6k per person over 7 years... they definitely made money.. Also they probably went on convention which itself cost money.. so they probably spend about $20k over 7 years conservatively for BOTH..but they manage to lose only $10k for 2 people. So they made about $10K from the product and this does not include tax refund since you are consider self employ by deducting those convention and conference tickets and those products which they order per month.
So they probably didn't do much and say they lost money. Hey you don't know anything what do you expect.. your business will go down...it's like you don't show up at your cel phone store, do you expect to have clients coming in!?
Or they made money near the beginning of the 7 years span and start fizzling out near the end and finally lost money. Hey business like that happens.
At the end, $10 to even 15k lost over 7 year for a business is not bad ESPECIALLY if assuming they didn't do jack over the last few years. Had they stuck to it, they made be in the black instead of the red.
(even people who takes vitamins and doesn't do anything end up spending more than they did).
So to me, that is not a lost.. It's their own doing.
If they say lost 10k in 1 year, I will like to analyze what are they doing.. but 10k in year is also not bad consider other businesses can be 5 times that amount in 1 year. Gotta understand effort and business my friend.
10K to 15K loss on a USANA distributorship is a pretty bad thing, and is what will happen the longer you stay in the USANA pyramid scheme. Now we're talking about hundreds of thousands of people who have joined USANA's business who were all drawn to the business through some business opportunity meeting and were deceived into joining by shown misleading data on the statistical likelihood they could make money. Now hundreds of thousands of people are losing 10K throughout their tenure as a distributor. That's $1 billion in losses per 100,000 people. THAT is a big deal. So while you brush off $10,000 as no big loss, the company is swindling billions out of its vast number of distributors who are all misled when they signed the contract to join.
DeleteUSANA has had over 2 million distributors since 1992. Close to 99% of them never made a profit. If only 5% of them lost over $10,000 as a USANA distributor, that's a very serious billion dollar problem. The losses accumulated from all USANA distributors could be several billion dollars. Congratulations USANA... This is why MultiLevelMarketing is so devastating. Stop looking at it as a minimal loss for someone...
You are comparing apple and oranges.
Delete10k to 15k lost for a business over the span of 7 years IS NOTHING compare to people who lose 50k for 2 years in a business. We are talking about businesses here, not the company as a whole.
What you are talking about is the company as a whole whether or not they are making a profit themselves but that is just ludicrous..why?
1) That is almost like comparing how many people in this world that lost money starting flower business or restaurant businesses or etc.. If I do that math, that will scare the heck out of everyone...that is a trillion dollar problem for other industries. Do you know how many people failed in the Real estate business..after spending money on books and seminar,etc? That number since 1992 will scare the heck out of you as it's in the trillions of dollars spent. (At least these people are taking the vitamins themselves) Oh how about education.. there are so many people who spend so many money on education and didn't do jack, so that is a scam too .a trillion dollar scam and loss. Same with gym memberships..so many fat people now they are blaming gym and the 'scam' memberships because they are fat and didn't improve because they never went into the gym in the first place. If you count that for Ballys or whatever other company, that number is also shatteringly big because the loss accumulated from all pass Bally (or whatever company) membership because the fat person didn't get thin will also be in the billions. So Bally scammed them too from your 'logical' argument.
2) Also, the fact that they are consuming the vitamins themselves. So that is a not a billion dollar problem. They are consuming the vitamins themselves and the downlines who takes them. What about others who signed on as distributors but only takes them and not do anything. Their goal is the vitamins.. not the business. And if someone wants some, they can just refer them and sign them on if they want. These consumers doesn't care about profits.
3) What you calculated is assuming 99% lost. Again like I said if you count the Bally memberships or the Re business as a whole or just one company, that amount will be huge because the mass number of people who can join in easily and only a few will be discipline enough to do anything. btw, 99% is overstatement by your bias. I would say about 90%
I'm comparing the one USANA distributor that lost 10K to all of the USANA distributors that lost 10K. So in this sense, I'm comparing 1 apple to 100,000 apples...
Delete1) In every example you provided you failed to provide any actual numbers of people who made the attempt. How many people in the world started a flower business? How many people started a restaurant business? Real Estate business became saturated because there were too many agents (supply and demand). Just as with MLM, when there is a real estate agent living on every block, most of them will fail. If there was a McDonalds on every block, most will go out of business. This is why there are territorial restrictions, which prevents this event from happening.
Your example about school has nothing to do with losing money. Do you believe higher education should be free? If it is free, then it is worthless.
Your point about gym memberships and calling these gyms scams is ridiculous. If someone doesn't go to the gym when they have a membership, then they can't blame the gym if they are fat. However, if they actually go to the gym and work out, they will most certainly lose weight. Unfortunately this concept does not apply to USANA distributors because the business model is, "by design", going to fail almost every single participating member no matter how hard they try. In a perfect world, the very best USANA distributors can achieve is a 88% loss rate. This also happens to be the loss rate for the classic pyramid scheme. However, because of a whole slew of factors, the loss rate for USANA and all other MLMs are 99%.
2) If someone signs a USANA business contract, they do so with the intent to make money. Otherwise they would be preferred customers because the price of the product is the same for either group. If you activated your business center, you're intent is to make money. If you are filing taxes for your USANA distributorship, then your intent is to make money. Otherwise you are committing tax fraud. Those that do not care about losing money in USANA are lying to you. Perception is everything to a USANA distributor, and is why distributors will say almost anything to try and recruit people in their downline.
3) What I calculated is assuming only 5% lost 10K or more, and there have been at least 2 million USANA distributors since 1992. 100,000 distributors * $10,000 = $1 billion is losses (from just those 5%). Go ahead and count the Bally memberships. Get that information of total memberships versus those that did not lose a single pound. Then you can talk about percentages.
@Watchdog, how come they didn't refund the products when they are in the red? Surely it's better to cut loss than digging through a debt hole.
ReplyDeleteex-silver director 2009
Deletesurely you are not a top director with this question.. rarely anyone will return a used product.. its embarrassing to return used products... you also have to pay for shipping, 10% restocking fee.. if you have a downline and you encourage for them return the products then you are a rare associate.. Usana does not recycle the returned product so returning the product is the same as throwing it in the garbage. 10% restocking fee and usana will not of lost any $ because it cost less than that to make the products..
Now you know why.. how can you refund them when you have 6 to 7 years of product usage. They have made money by just 'losing 10k'. I know someone who only takes the vitamins and spent about 9k in 7 years and that's one person. They have 2.. 2 people lose 10k..is about 5k per person which is not bad for a business at all over a 7 years span.
DeleteIf you know anything about business (and not saying you don't), most people lose about more than 10k in the 1st year alone. and at then end.. they lose more than 20k. in a few years less than 5 years. So don't tell me usana business model is not working...it's minizing your risk but no limit on potential.
I just started building my business in USANA. I started my own team and I already getting free products with the compensation plan. I didn't pressure and force anyone to join me. I simply shared the opportunity. Nobody got mad at me. Some of my friends joined me. Being an upline, I didn't see 99% of my team lost money because they have quality products in return. What I did is study network marketing strategies before joining and sharing what I learned with my team. We don't force recruit anyone and we don't chase prospects. We talk to them sharing our business and if they don't like it then we simply shake hands and still be friends. USANA's compensation plan is TEAMWORK BASED BUSINESS. You work for yourself not by yourself. You work with a team. I have no problem with the monthly quota. I believe USANA just wants me to stay healthy to enjoy my life to its fullest.
ReplyDeleteTell me that in say about 7 years later.
DeleteThat's why happen to that guy to that watchdoggies friend.
They probably said the same thing and then stop doing stuff and start 'losing' money when it's perfectly justifiable that they lose it since they don't work on it! duh.
Here in the philippines you have to autoorder 100 points worth of products which is around $175. After sharing it to my friends 3 of them joined and I already had my commission. I don't really understand how you lose money when you can always use or sell the products you buy during monthly autoship.
ReplyDeleteI just want to share my thoughts to everyone that reads this blog, network marketing is a profession. You need to learn, train and educate yourself before entering a business you know nothing about. The internet has so many articles providing tips, trainings, and strategies to become successful. You can't win a game if you don't know the rules.
ex-silver director 2009
Deletehow much was your commission.... did you spend on a pro-pack? then there is no possible way to be on the positive side of profit with only 3 downlines.. if you spent on a basic pack ($380) and if your downlines purchased that also then you have not yet been on the profit also.... and how much did your 3 friends paid total? they are not in the profit side.. you can work hard all you want but the only one you're making rich is the diamond on top of your and Dr. Wentz and shareholders.
the obvious that I always repeat here... get a calculator... add what everyone has spent... and add everyone's commission..... you guy's commission will be about 10% of what everyone has spent total...
how do you think usana pays for trips for growth 25, free Ipads, manufacturing, marketing, celebs they pay for like OZ from spiderman. oops.. I mean Dr. OZ who happens to be an expert in weight loss supplements.
what I did was I did the direct selling business. I bought a BDS for $22 and bought 3 Essentials only for $170 because I did not have enough money then I used 1 pair of the essentials. Then I talked to 2 of my relatives, sold 2 Essentials with 10% retail mark up then I used the money they paid to buy to 2 more and sold it again then repeat until I have accumulated 400 points activating 3 BCs. I did it in 3 weeks. The thing is I dont have a job so I had so much time to find customers and I started with my relatives and their friends. I just borrowed money from my parents. I returned $140 to my parents so the total money that I spent was $82 but got a net income of $70 which I used for traveling expenses. While selling the products, I shared the opportunity with my friends in my first 2 weeks 1 joined and in the 4th week 2 joined. So I got commission because my upline place a member under me so I got 4 persons under me in my first month so I got a 400 GSV and $80 CSV.
DeleteAll in all, I only lost $82 for buying and using 1 pair of essentials and the BDS but I had an income of $150 - $82 = $68 profit in my endeavor. I taught my friends the same strategy I did so the money they spent on the membership didnt cost as much. I know this isnt enough to make a living out of, but hey, I just started. Its not like its a get-quick-rich scheme. Ofcourse starting out requires great effort for little gain but in the long run, consistency will show that from great effort with little income will becomes less effort with big income. You just have to work for it.
I guess I can't judge someone if they lost money with USANA because I don't know the details but that doesnt mean everybody is bound to fail. We just need to work harder.
Do you know why usanawatch of dog are so free? nope, he just earn comission by others company for write this blog, so it never dare to show who it are
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Adan, please don't misrepresent. There is no real cure for gout. There is preventive measures for gout from reoccurring and one of the most effective ways is with this products. Others are like no beer and meat..and only veggies. Geez that means the person have to turn vegetarian to prevent it!?
DeleteNo way for me. I"m a meat eater. gouts will reoccur, but of all methods I have tried, this usana method of preventation is so far the most effective I have tried. Anyone who never had gout will never know what it's like. For years now, I don't have reoccurrence of gout.. after constant reoccurrence at a constant intervals of a few months.
I just got diagnosed with GOUT, and reading this actually made me feel like crawling and crying like a baby. The outbreak I have right now is genital and in my throat and mouth, I talked to the doctor who did the blood test on me and said over time that it would eventually get much better. She said that what I’m having is a massive outbreak and is unusual, but that it may be due to the fact that I stressed myself out over it so much. She also told me even though I have it in the genital area that It doesn't mean that I needed “private to private” contact to acquire it. But this did make me feel a whole lot better about the whole situation. For anyone else to has GOUT after all this stress and pains am passing and the doctor saying all such of crap i was not convince by his Theory so i decided to go on the internet and saw this comments by Rose who testify about how she get cured by root and herbs by Dr ahineh, when i first bump into it i didn't believe the comments at first so i decided to confront her on Facebook and really know what and how did it work because my doctor told me there is no cure for herpes, so i really contacted DR AHINEH, he responded in A minute the only thing he ever ask for was just the items of which he will use to prepare for the herbs, after all this he send the herbs through courier Services, within a week i was cure just like that without no struggle or stress, if you are out there in need of cure contact him with his email address, DRAHINEH@YAHOO.COM OR CALL HIM ON +2348158665394
ReplyDeletehe also cure HIV
herpes
and diabetes
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Deleteunfortunately, it isn't sarcasm. A quick search of the phone number reveals this particular message is spammed all over the internet.
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